Gary_Fullett joined. swetz ::biggrin rhonda Hi Joe and soilguy DaveM gary hello carnac joined. swetz hi Dave and soil rhonda Hi carnac Gary_Fullett good evening all Joe_K mornen Rhonda, Amos, Gary, Swetz, Pat rhonda Hi Gary Gary_Fullett boker tov amos swetz hi Gary and carnac and Joe Coooooooooooooool Joe_K shoot everyone ! Gary_Fullett about 7 cant make it tonight JP ::smile Gary_Fullett thier loss Joe_K Yen Bulls ? Joe_K lol swetz howdy partner, JimC (my tax buddy), warren Joe_K or Silver Bears ? Amos actually as long as they read the archives--not such a big loss Joe_K lol DaveM any posted material tonight gary/amos? swetz hi carnac soilguy Hi Rhonda Swetz Dave Gary Joe and all others Amos I am going to cheat tonight. Gary_Fullett they do amos swetz I think we are going to talk about spreads and Taylor Joe_K Hi Soilguy Gary_Fullett over 500 read the logs carnac hi swetz Gary_Fullett and we get 25-35 per night class swetz hi carnac swetz ::biggrin Amos Not that I want to cheat-but the lack of other visuals forces me rhonda wow that is amazing Gary, cool DaveM fair enought Joe_K penalty over 25 years ( cant cheat ) 5 demerits DaveM enought Joe_K :) Gary_Fullett not as much as ABC news but what the ehck lol DaveM enough Kelley joined. swetz lol Gary, if it makes you feel any better, I read your logs before I watch ABC news swetz ::smile Joe_K Count Yellek !!! Gary_Fullett no news swetz lol Joe_K :) swetz lol Amos I want to spend some time today to show you that most of the good traders "talk" the same way. rhonda Kelley!!! ::beer swetz howdy kelleyroni Doc_K joined. Amos I will quote you some of Taylor's original material and you will see Kelley hi Swetz, rhonda::wine, Joey:) rhonda ::smile swetz hi DocK Kelley hi Amos Cohen Doc_K hello all and sweetz Amos One comment about Feb and March- Historically March is WIDEER than Feb Amos Just to mention Larry joined. swetz hi Larry, Amos is just starting kent joined. Larry hi swetz, thx chad is there chart works with this stuff ? Kelley hi Kent, just starting JimC left. swetz no charts tonight chad BBob joined. Gary_Fullett chad on tuesday charst are sent out kent ty Kelley Amos I will COPY from Taylor's book for a while--so there is not much personal commenting--but I will try to Emphasize certain points carnac some draw line across jan.-feb. high to buy in march. JimC joined. Kelley yw Gary_Fullett they are on the site or can eb emailed if u write kelly at knorris@ltg-trading.com sometimes amos sends charts but not this eveing Steve_W joined. DaveM bob,,,not started yet BBob ok thanks chad ty very much the chart sessions tue GFullett ? Amos He wrote his stuff some 70 years ago. Amos Here is a sample: Emile joined. Art joined. Kelley hi Art & Emile, just starting Emile Hello BBob GOOG high 478.68 Art hi Kelley and everyone Steve_W Are charts posted? Amos "a trader who uses the short term method DOES NOT need to look very far ahead, therefore the BOOK METHOD does not concern itself with commodity ECONOMICS Amos nor..." Amos "It is concerned entriely with OBJECTIVE POINTS FOR BUYING, SELLING and SHORT SELLING on the MINOR MOVEMENTS of the market..." jc joined. kent hey JC, just starting jc hi kent Amos A Trader does NOT reach for the gossip file when he comes in , his DECISION has been REACHED before the MARKET OPENING.... Amos Of course the trader SHOLD study and KNOW all about his business the sam as in any other line of endeavor.... Amos "A Traeder, Operatpr. is exactly what a SPECULATOR should be, an Operator, MANIPULATOR and a trader--and he MUST understand the FUNDAMENTALS OF MANIPULATION to be a good trader since manipulation enters into the market at all time Amos NOTE: The guy was an old codger as they call them. He STARTS his whole book with the notion that the MARKET IS MANIPULATED IN PART and this is PART OF HIS METHOD Amos I do not know how this is connected to the CONCEPT OF THE CM--but it is clear that he is thinking that way. Amos (this is me , Amos, talking)///What I am trying to show is that most of the good traders THINK THE SAME WAY Amos IT DOES NOT MATTER the EXACT TERMS THEY USE, Amos It does NOT matter the EXACT METHOD they use Amos IT DOES NOT MATTER the particular time frame they use Amos BUT THEY HAVE A CERTAIN FRAME OF WORK OF THE MARKET and they operate in the WAY THAT IS CONVENIENT TO THEM Amos This is, in my opinion, why All those MARKET WIZARDS could make big money WHILE OPERATING A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY from each other Amos Back to Taylor: Amos "Now suppose the speculator that understood the fundamentals of Manipultion, wanted to do some trading, what would he look for? chad be back tue with chart learning ty gary Amos "Well, he would FIRST look for INSIDE BUYING or SELLING and since this is ALL REVEALED BY THE TAPE, this is just what he would do-- chad left. Amos "He would READ THE TAPE TRYING TO DISCEERN the BUYING and selling and which way prices WERE moving or more apt to move, ... skylar joined. Amos "The trader using this method would look for a movment MORE OR LESS MECHANICAL in it's action for tactics of manipulation do take on a MECHANICAL ACTION after a while" Amos Amos: This is important. Amos The Concept of REPETITION is what lies at the BASIS OF all that we learn herer. Amos If you call it the WYCKOFF METHOD, or the "MODELS" I am looking for, or waves, or whatever-=-This concept of REPEPETITIVE behavior lies at the core skylar left. skylar joined. Amos I assume this works because of HUMAN MATURE which has not changed since ADAM AND EVE-- We do not HATE more than CAIN HATED ABEL ,. We do not LOVE more than AMNON LOVED TAMAR or DAVID LOVED JONATHAN, we are as JEALOUS and AVARICIOUS as they were Amos But the basic thing is to UNDERSTAND THE WAY MANIPULATION WORKS Amos Taylor: Amos "Let us look at the manipulative side of the market and what takes place in preparation to a move in a STOCK or COMMODITY and the tape action is the SAME FOR ALL, GRAIN, STOCKS and COMMODITIES Amos "Now let us assume that all the preliminary work has been done, gerneral and special information on a Particular stock of commodity...earining reports and business conditions....THE BOOK TRADER NEED NOT PAY too much ATTENTION Amos " to these matters--he knows that once trend starts--BULL OR BEAR--that it will continue for an indefinite period of time and that eihter way it will contain MANY TRADING AREAS RALLIES AND DECLINES Amos "Let us suppos a stock or future was BEING MANIPULATED with the intent to put up the price, just how wuold it be done, one of the ways and pehaps a method employed by MOST MANIPULATORS both past and prsent would be for him to start buying, assuming of course, that he already had ACCUMULATED HIS LINE Amos were rhigt for a move". Amos This, to those who remember some of LIVERMORE latter chapter (after page 250, that is where Jesse's Book REEAALLY STARTS) Amos is EXACTLY HOW HE DESCRIBES HIS OWN WAY OF MOVING A STOCK warren left. Amos So you can IMMEDIATELY SEE that there is NO BASIC DIFFERENCE between Livermore, Or WYCKOFF, or TAYLOR. Amos This is why Traders like LINDA MENTION ALL OF THEM in the same breath. Amos Basically it all EMENATES FROM THE SAME SOURCE. Amos What I am trying to say is that ONCE YOU GRASP CERTAIN IMPORTANT ELEMENTS of The "THEORY OF TRADING"-- IT really does not matter how exactly you EMPLOY THOSE PRINCIPLES. Amos This is why every trader finds his/her OWN NITCH Amos This is why David gravitated to ELLIOTT--because he felt that it could expand his abilities Amos This is why I studied WYckoff very intensively for years AFTER I took the course and after I TAUGHT some of his material and I ADAPTED some of his terms to FIT MY PERSONALITY Amos One of the most imporant things about trading is that IN THE LAST CASTER STAND--IT IS ALWAYS BETWEEN YOU AND THE MARKET Amos It does not matter what OHTER SAY Amos You ARe the one who must face your decisions Alvin joined. JD joined. Amos Livermore says he CANNOT LISTEN TO TIPS because if he ENTERS THE MARKET via someone else's tip-- HE MUST LEAVE THE MARKET with that tip. Amos GUESS WHAT?! Amos 99% of the tipsters are NOT TO BE FOUND when their tip goes awry! Amos If you do not know what to do when your METHODOLOGY goes WRONG-- YOU WILL DIE IN THE MARKET Amos That is why MOST GOOD TRADERS MUST USE THEIR OWN WAY OF TRADING because ONLY THEY KNOW WHAT TO DO WHEN THEIR THIKING ABOUT THE PARTICULAR SITATION went wrong Amos IF YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO WHEN YOU INITIAL TRAEDING decision went wrong-- YOU DIE Amos But STILL---All THE GREAT ONES--START WITH SIMILAR BASIC ASSUPMTIONS!!!! Joe_K Standing Ovation Amos This is why trading is such a difficult business. Doc_K astounding conclusion Amos Most people do not want to stand alone and know that it is up to them to make ALL DIFFICULT DECISIONS Amos Later on in his book TAYLOR SAYS SOMETHING LIKE THAT: Amos " NEVER TRADE IF IT DOES NOT FAVOR YOUR CHANCES TO WIN Amos MIND YOU-- HE IS WRITING A VERY DETAILED METHOS OF "BOOK TRADING" Amos HE GOES ABOUT CLASSIFIYING EACH DAY AS either a BUY day, A Sell day (when you TAKE YOUR PROFITS FROM PREVIOUS DAY) and a SELL SHORT DAY which tells you if you sell short early in the day or wait to see what the market is doing as at which "OBJECTIVE" Points you should do your short selling Amos He is telling you when To cover you shorts or longs even if they DO NOT REACH THEIR OBJECTIVES because the market changed its behavior or the High of the day was made first or last.. or the LOW of the day was made first or last Amos .....and with all that DETAILED RECEPET (?) he is telling you that if you see something that DOES NOT FAVOR YOUR PLAY--DOn't DO IT Amos This is WHY SO FEW PEOPLE USE TAYLOR Amos Listen carefully! Amos Many have read him and quote him but I DO NOT KNOW ANY PURE TAYLOR TRADER Amos WHY? Amos Exactly because he gives you some leewway Amos THAT LEEWAY is where people get lost. Amos HOW DO YOU KNOW WHEN CONDITIONS " DO NOT FAVOR YOUR PLAY?" Amos This is where the CONCEPT OF SKILL ENTERS. Amos Anecdote: I worked once with 2 guys and we tried to form a trading group. One was doing all the daily analysis. Amos One was trading on the floor and would get instructions from "upstairs" Amos IT worked and it did not work for personal reasons but in the process the guy would come back from the floor and tell stories about one of the BEST traders on the floor and we started to call him the "SHARK" Amos The guy would come to the floor and stand there DOING NOTHING for DAYS ON END! Amos Just stand there observing and his hands are crossed on his chest. Amos Then when the market would get close to areas of SUPPORT AND RESISTANCE (similar aread that we identified in our work and were willing to trade too) Amos ALL OF A SUDDEN THE GUY WOULD BURST AND START FLAILING HIS ARMS AND WOULD BID OR OFFER FOR HUNDREDS OF CONTRACTS Amos It was on the CBOE FLOOR-- so it was actuallyl OEX OPTIONS Amos Why did we call him the shark? Amos Because the SHARK has survived MILLIONS OF YEARS by befoming one BORING AND WONDERFUL MACHINE Amos SHarks do ONLY 3 THINGS: THEY SWIM Amos THEY MATE Amos and they EAT Amos That is it Amos No TV, No Vacations, no SHmoozing Amos Just do those 3 things in the same way for millions of years-- and you got it made kent lol Joe_K Sleep dont pay Tom left. Amos We could now believe how this guy would PASS so many other "OPPORTUNITIES" but wait for THOSE SITUATIONS where his LOK (this is where this term came from--we had to give this "entry a name") was HIGH JP dreams pay Amos He was a VERY SUCCESSFUL TRADER. Amos So, Some develope special skills to enter the market and leave the market at differetn places Amos BUT THE SKILLS YOU DEVELOP ARE UNIQUE Amos they can come ONLY THRU EXPERIENCE Amos This is the sad thing Amos You cannot "TEACH" skills-- you have to be in the trenches to ACQUIRE THEM Amos this is why longevity is so important in this business. Amos For every Baldwin or Richard Dennis who can become good traders within months-- MOST HUMAN BEINGS become good traders or better traders WITH TIME--because it takes time to GET THOSE SKILLS Amos By definition that will mean that each one of us will be a BETTER TRADER in CERTAIN MARKET CONDITIONS and NOT GOOD TRADERS UNDER DIFFERENT MARKET CONDITIONS Amos This is why they have the cliche that good traders trade for a few months a year and THEN MUST TAKE OFF. Amos Not for vacation--but because the market enters phases that DO NOT FIT THEIR TRADING SKILLS. Amos WAITING FOR THOSE PERIODS WHEN you "SEE " the market is very profitable. Amos FORCING THE MARKET when you are NOT IN SYNCH with it--is VERY TIRING and VERY COSTLY Amos Back to Taylor: Amos ""by making the stock active, coupled with the rising prices, the traders, professionals and the buying public, Amos "attracted by this activityh come in as buyers. This outside demand is filled with the stock the operator was compelled to buy in starting the move"..... Amos Again--same as Livermore: He is describing a particular behavior of a Bottom, or accumulaton . Amos He is using a little different nomenclature than Wyckoff--but it is basically the same Amos He is describing a TRADING RANGE THAT IS ACTUAL ACCUMULATION John joined. John left. Gary_Fullett conected? John joined. Amos left. Amos joined. Joe_K Y swetz still alive kent y skylar is see ya gary Gary_Fullett okay Amos Sorry--computer froze had to reboot Gary_Fullett okay amos Amos At any rate-- as Taylor continues and sets up his parameters such as: Amos " ...this is the reason why the book becmes MECHANICAl in it's recordings of the minor trends--it points ou the MAIN OBJECTIVES Gary_W joined. Amos "on the respective trading days, even tho, any of thoese sessions may be filled with CURRENTS OR CROSS-CURRENTS, smaller rallies and declines" Amos NOTE: he is ferretting out the MAIN MOVES from the NOISY ONES.---this is one of the hardest things to do especially intraday--but he ASSUMES WE CAN LEARN TO DO THAT! Amos THIS IS, BY NECESSITY , AN INDIVIDUAL THING Amos Each one of us will SEE DIFFERENT MOVES as MORE SIGNIFICANT THAN OTHERS!!! Amos "At times when the way is clear and there are few or no selling order for some Distance above the market, the operator will RUN THE PRICE UP FAST, this action creates Amos "interest among the traders and brings in buying, the stock of which in turn is SUPPLIED BY THE OPERATOR and give him a chance to sell a little long stock and to put out some short sales" Amos You see? Amos He throws such a curve and you have to know how to hbandle it? Joe_K From what I understand George took the actions against a 3 day cycle metric Amos "There is NO MORE ASKING anybody what "THEY" think of the market--for having read these pages up to this point.... you can guess just about how much their opinion would be worth, unless they were greatly experienced traders and in that case they probably WOULD NOT HAVE AN OPINON TO OFFER Amos "NOT SO YOU COULD NOTICE IT-- Amos "it depends entirely on how the trader thinks and his experience and PATIENCE!!!" Amos "the Book Method follows the average of abourt a one day reaction for a decline and at times usually in a strong uptrend the decline low will be made in one sessions, the low will be made on the SHORT SALES DAY, however, another delcine will generally Amos "take place from this low and the testing of this low will come on the next day, on the4 BUYING DAY at wihch time the decline will generally stop--at, a little or slightly poerentrate this low. Amos "When the price hold above this low on a BUYING DAY , we call it BUYING A HIGHER BOTTOM" skylar left. Amos Amos: The last paragraph is marked with 2 "X" in my book Amos I read it many times. I know it is important Amos I know that there are situations when the market is acting exactly like this==BUT IT IS almost IMPOSSIBLE TO TRADE IT Amos Here is the bane, if you wish of his method. Amos He knows markets. Amos He knows manipulation. Amos His methodolgy is nailing the market many times very accurately--but YOU MUST BE DEDICATED TO THAT METHOD Amos Unless you ignore everything else and STRICTLY GO BY this rather NARROW approach--you will have TOO many situations that will frustrate you and you will GIVE UP Amos This is another important point Amos Any method that works for you-- and then enters a period where it DOES NOT WORK--MAY INJURE YOUR PSYCHE! Amos You must learn to accept the fact that the same thing that worked SO WELL in previous market or previous phase of the market--WILL NOT WORK RIGHT NOW--and WAIT FOR IT TO WORK AGAIN Amos YOU WILL KNOW WHEN IT WORKS--BECAUSE YOU WILL SEE IT ON THE CHART!! Amos One good example is the VIX Amos Do you know what VIX AND VXN ARE? swetz yes Joe_K Y kent y DaveM y Amos LOL this is like a waiter asking:"Would it be coffee or tea?" and you anser YES swetz lol Amos Ok let me tell you a little about VIX swetz they supposedly measure fear in the market Amos For years it was a HUGE MONEY MAKER. swetz a low vix means market participants are complacent Amos those of you who remember Rob from tfc--he made a ton of money on it Amos VIX is the measure of VOLATILITY. swetz a high vix means fear is at a high level Amos Sweta is right Amos When VIS WAS BELOW 10 it meant that people are in valhallah and it is time to SELL STOCKS because no fear in the market Larry vix for snp, vxn for nasdaq (volatility) Amos When VIX was above 30 or so--it meant PANIC and it was time to BUY STOCKS ( I saw the vix at 54 one time--in one of the big panics--but that happens once in 10 years) Amos Guess what Amos For the last 3 years--VIX IS NOT WORKING ANY MORE Amos I have read articel that try to explain it with " It is NOT THE LEVEL BUT THE TREND OF THE VIX" DaveM I've heard a lot of comentary on that point...not working Amos It has to do with the PUT-CALL RATIO"...you name it Amos IT IS ALL BULL SHIT! Amos The vix does not work becauase TOO MANY SCHMUCKS like Rob MADE TOO MUCH MONEY WITH IT kent lol Amos The market is a FANTASTIC SELF PRESERVING MECHANICS swetz lol Amos IT DOES NOT ALLOW ANY POWER TO GATHER TOO MUCH STRENGTH Amos It killed the HUNT BROTHERS, IT KILLED THE TURTLES, IT KILLED THE VIX and it will kill Fibonnaci and OF COURSSE IT KILLED PRECHTER. Amos Why did I mention VIX? Amos because VIX is the BASIS OF ALL OPTIONS TRADING jc rob was all bullshit talk as he took me for 18 K in his pool! Amos IF you trade options you MUST UNDERSTAND THE GREEKS Amos jc--you should never swim in a pool with your money BBob sounds like we have a death wish for ourselves.. just kill me softly jc lol, lucky i traded on my own and made it back swetz yep, I hear pools are where sharks gather swetz ::smile Kelley and beavers kent lol BBob blood suckers too swetz yikes Kelley :) jc lesson learned Amos The basic greek is DELTA wich is the STANDARD DEVIATION OR THE IMPLLIED VOLATILITY OF THE under...forgot the term Amos It is the LIFE BLOOD OF OPTION TRADERS Amos So VOLATILITY IS VERY IMPORTANT Amos That is why I keep an eye on the vix and check it once a week. Amos ONE OF THESE DAYS when EVERYONE WILL GIVE UP ON IT--it will work again because the GIANT BUSINESS OF OPTIONS IS BASED UPON IT. Amos I do not know enough about the mathematics of the instrument to explain HOW THEY CAN MAKE AN INSTRUMETN STOP WORKING FOR A WHILE--BUT THEY CAN Joe_K "underlying asset" Delta Amos This is just one good example of a method that worked for a few years-- and made a lot of money to its users-- and then ONE DAY IT JUST STOPPED Amos Yes, asset was the word I was looking for, thanks Joe Amos How do you cope with it? Amos You ACCEPT IT. Amos You do not fight it. Amos You move aside. Amos You WAIT, YOU OBSERVE. Amos YOU KNOW THAT THE MARKET IS THERE and if you wait long enough--the next train is coming Joe_K Y JP ::smile Amos This is the TROUBLE OF FORCING YOUR TRADE EVERY DAY. kent Wyckoff oberved the markets for 14 years before he traded, a good lesson Amos If you are a SCALPER by definition and you are HAPPY with this--fine---You have many more situations to pick from --so you can find a good trade without needing to wait long enoug Amos But if you are a TREND FOLLOWER-- You may have to wait 6-9 months for a GOOD ENTRY POINT. Amos I am NOT TELLING YOU WHICH WAY TO GO--EACH ONE OF YOU--has to FIND THE METHOD THAT FITS THEIR PERSONLAITY Amos BUT YOU MUST recognize this shortcoming and realize that good trades--SHOULD NOT APPEAR ALL THE TIME. Amos Waiting-- is NOT A HUMAN STRENGTH Amos Most people find it very hard to wait Joe_K Never understood how it could take 5-6 years to learn patience Amos But that is one of the thing I tried to share with you when I first came here--when I said that it is simply IMPOSSIBLE to trade on different time frames at the same time JP comes naturally to a hunter perhaps Joe_K ( Yeah but this prey hunts back ) Joe_K lol Amos The story of JPM not buying any stock between 1929 adn 1932 is probably true Amos BUT this is ONE OF THE ADVANTAGES OF MONEY. Amos One of the MAIN REASONS why "MONEY GOES TO MONEY" is because when you have money-- YOU DO NOT HAVE TO WORRY about the Rent and the MOrtgage Amos If you know that the opportunity will come and you can wait for it-- you are king Amos I mentioned to Gary the spread of wheat and soybeans. Amos Look at the Daily , weekly and Monthly of that spread. Amos The monthly chart is at important SUPPORT now Amos So the spread might turn Amos BUT ONE OF THE THINGS I LEARNED ABOUT SPREADS is that it is better to WAIT FOR THE ACTUAL SIGNAL Amos If you can go to your chart-- CQG is much better than E-Signal because E-Signal continuations charts suchh to high heaven Amos Put the weekly spread of the Nasdaq over the S&P Amos Look at the decline after the rally after 9/11. Amos This was one of G-d's gift to traders if you ever saw one! Amos All you had to do is look at the WEEKLY CHART. Amos This is FRIDAY CLOSE MIND YOU! Amos And you see a clear LOWEWR LOW AND LOWER HIGH Amos ALL YOU HAD TO DO is SIT ON YOUR HANDS and tell yourself: Amos "I AM NOT TOUCHING THIS UNTIL I SEE A SIGNAL!" Amos in this case it would have been a HIGHER HIG Amos IF YOU DID THIS-- YOU COULD HAVE BOUGHT THE NASDAQ around 770! Amos Never got stopped out Amos This it the type of trades that happens once in a while--and if you keep watching for it and WAIT FOR THE SIGNAL!! ==you are KINGS Amos I do look at spreads once in a while--why? Amos Becauses many professional traders use them Amos I could never understood why traers could go home with 20,000 spread open and not ONE naked single commodity Amos I actually had such friends on the floor Amos For some reasons they feel that having a short against each of their longs--protcts them. Amos I know that Gary pays attention to spread. Amos I only look at their LONG TERM CHARTS and ONCE IN A WHILE--they really give you a clear picture Amos Perhaps this is BECAUSE so many professional use them John left. Amos I am NOT talking about significant spreads like the NOB or the Crush or the CRACK --that actually represent important insightfull understanding of the picture of supply and demand (NOB is the YIELD CURVE) Amos but just generally lookin at different spreads Amos The live catlle==hog spread Amos the Heating oil- Unleaded spreads Amos Once in a while they go out of whack but on the long term charts--they reach VERY IMPORTANT SUPPORT RESISTANCE or give you some simple entry points-- gifts Amos I am typing too much Gary_Fullett you are doing well Amos I just want to mention again what I said at the hbegining swetz good stuff Amos Amos February is shaping out to be rather volatile. Amos In general MARCH IS MORE VOLATILE THAN FEB--so be prepared for more volatility in the next few weeks Joe_K Yen in trouble again Amos ? Amos Watch that wheat soy spread Amos Yen is not in trouble for the Carry traders Amos I am wrong on my semi annual chart on the yen and MUST WAIT Joe_K Wondering if 8050 is vaiable under the poss Weekly Spring attempt Amos I think that the IBM chart we spoke about is very crucial-- Joe_K tough one Amos A WEEKLY THRUST NOW will be a THRUST AFTER LARGE KEY REVERSAL and can take IBM to the 91 level-- that is the count I saw on Stockchart swetz agree Amos, really watching IBM Amos My alarm on Ibm is at 98.40 Amos my alarm on the dow is at 12725 Amos I cannot over emphasize the most CRUCIAL POINT OF TRADING--TRADE SELECTION Joe_K :) Amos GATHER ALL THE INFORMATION you can on an instument. get all the points of SUPPORT RESISTANCE Amos ALL THE POOINTS OF IMPORTANT VOLUME Amos All the POINOTS OF POTENTIAL CYCLES Amos ALL THE POOINTS OF COUTING BARS AND SYMMETRY Amos ALL THE IMPORTANT FIBO NUMBERS (that is for me) Amos and make sure that you are ready for them--ready meants--to observe and act IF THEY DO SOMETHING Amos in other words FOLLOW THE MARKET rather than PREDICT IT Amos I know we had some trouble in the past on that--but I hoope you begin to understand that I use the word PRDICT only in its PEFORATIVE meaning-- if y ou use the Amos IF - THEN PARADIGM--nothing is wrong with that kind of PREDICTION Amos Ok--I am rambling Amos Enough for one day. kent good stuff, Amos, thanks a bunch swetz ::coolsmile full of wisdom Amos Larry yes, ty Amos Amos Keep gathering good info and make sure you are READSY when your information arrives JP thank you Amos Steve_W Thanks, lots of insights Gary_Fullett amos u ahve tiem for a few questions? Gary_Fullett have time? Amos Make sure you use the ALERT and ALARM SYSTEMS on your comoputer--it is a great helper Amos shhot Alvin thanks amos Amos shoot Gary Gary_Fullett anyone Gary_Fullett i m a bad aim lol Gary_Fullett anyonew have any questions Joe_K Good stuff tonight ( more ink costs ) Joe_K :( swetz Amos, on your VOB and VOT models DaveM got alarms watching alarms.....buzzers going off everywhere lol swetz is the trigger the ST of them swetz secondary test of them swetz like a thrust after VOB Joe_K thinking 99.06 to 99 nt IBM Amos For me a high volume day (or very low volume day)--is a very important day ory joined. Joe_K 1 min bar Joe_K :) Amos Usually I expect that a large volume day will dictate the "trend" for several day Art left. Joe_K I used that type bar on Wheat Amos I am more relaxed about statying with a trade following an important high volume day Amos Of course it depends WHERE IT IS COING FROM Amos If it comes from a range in a low area after a large decline--then it may be a rally for several day swetz yep, makes sense Amos I pay attention to DAILY VOLUME more than intraday volume Amos The trouble with E-SIGNAL VOLUME is that it is FALSE ory difference being Amos They use only the CONTRACT VOLUME instead of TOTAL VOLUME--That is where CQG is superior Amos You have no idea how long I gought with CQG to put TOTAL VOLUME on their charts Amos Now many do it ory both volumes are the same Amos VOB and VOT depend how accurately you ANALYZE the RANGE PRIOR TO THEM swetz I am still fighting with tradestation to do Wyckoff style PnF charts swetz but stockcharts seems to work pretty well for me ory Pleaseb keep fighting Swetz Steve_W If tired of bells and buzzers, go to www.cfs-technologies.com and download speakonia, a free text reader. Can type in warnings like "IBM hit alert" and it will create wav file that plays alert. Have to play around with it Amos swetz-- I use CQG P&F but I STILL DO ALL MY CHARTS BY HAND because even CQG is WRONG MANY TIMES Amos For example: if Ibm goes from 88 to 90.90 is this 3 points or 2 points? Amos Of course it is 3 points--but the machine ignores this Amos BAD! swetz yep, machine says 2 points ory but we can see the spread Amos But there is NO available good P&F program and the few that are really good--are NOT FOR SALE! swetz pretty hard to keep up with stocks on PnF isn't it because so many out there? swetz I thought your PnF target on IBM was as good as anything Amos I use the opotion of USER DEFINITION in Stock charts--and that is PRETTY GOOD swetz yep, I do the same thing Amos swetz ::smile ory description Amos No swetz, you asked me once and I glanced at it briefly--may look at it more DaveM text version on 60 min bar....freebie at stockcharts Amos ok 10 pm good night good folks Kelley thank you Mr. Cohen have a good night Steve_W Thanks Amos bye Steve_W left. swetz thx so much Amos Amos left. DaveM thx amos ory TY Amos JimC left. jc nite amos and all kent c ya JC :) jc left. swetz gn JC Gary_Fullett ty amos Gary_Fullett how was tonight Joe_K Was good session kent great Joe_K very Kelley yes, good swetz yep, was very good I though ory for the little i saw was very good swetz thought JP y DaveM good...got to get my livermore book out again ... Joe_K lol Gary_Fullett its archive Gary_Fullett any questions kent archived DaveM n Joe_K Get some sleep Pubba swetz no questions from me Joe_K See yas at CC bell Kelley no q's Joe_K :) DaveM thanks for this forum and opportunity again gary JP gn Thanks. Kelley good night folks, ty :) Gary_Fullett see u all tomoorow kent gn Kelley Gary_Fullett ty u all was great Joe_K Count Yellek will stand night watch kent :) Joe_K :) Gary_Fullett left.