User [gary fullett /171.208.27.87] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:02:26 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> good evening
<sherri> hi gary
<jack> yes hi gary
<sherri> are we supposed to have certain charts
<gary fullett> not tonight
<sherri> ok
<gary fullett> just the wyckoff wave
<jack> I have that
<sherri> can't get the book about wyckoff written by weis
<sherri> and two others
User [mrj /206.251.171.223] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:04:35 EDT 2000
<sherri> hi mrj
<mrj> Hi gary sherri jack
<sherri> brb
<jack> hello
User [Dene /207.50.1.174] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:04:59 EDT 2000
<mrj> Gary hope you don't mind me dropping in
<Dene> Hi everyone
<mrj> hi dene
<gary fullett> good evening everyon
<jack> hi dene
User [Jeradatar /209.82.119.108] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:05:46 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> I would like to conduct this class
<gary fullett> for 1 hour tonight
<gary fullett> and continue
<gary fullett> on Wednesday evening
<gary fullett> for the next month
<sherri> ok
<jack> ok
User [Guest /204.119.225.161] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:06:15 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> so there will be about 8 classes
<gary fullett> so wyckoff classes will be on Monday and wednesday nights
<gary fullett> at 7 pm central time in this room
<gary fullett> I will go over the principles of richard D Wyckoff
<gary fullett> a trader in the early 1900's
<gary fullett> If you have nay questions at any time please feel feel to ask
<gary fullett> this is an open forum
<sherri> k
<gary fullett> and we will be conducting this class
<gary fullett> from the beginning
<gary fullett> there are also archives on the site
<gary fullett> from previous classes as well as these new classes
<gary fullett> I also have classes on Monday thru Thursday nights in this room
<gary fullett> they go over the same principles
<gary fullett> but they are alittle more in detail
<gary fullett> but again everyone is welcome
<gary fullett> There is No charge for these classes
<gary fullett> there is No obligation for these
<gary fullett> clases
<gary fullett> It is all free
<sherri> ;-) thanks
<gary fullett> I will assume that no one has no trading experiences
<gary fullett> so we can all be on the same level.
User [Peggy /206.173.174.138] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:10:10 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> again please use the archives to look at other wyckoff
<mrj> hi peggy
<gary fullett> material
<Peggy> Mr J
<gary fullett> in this chat on occassion u must it the return key so u wont be booted out of the room
<Peggy> Looking for my daughter in here
<gary fullett> okay?
<jack> 
<gary fullett> Before I begin are htere any questions?
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> okay lets begin
<gary fullett> My name is Gary Fullett
<sherri> where do I find the weis book
<gary fullett> I have been trading for the past 19 yrs
<gary fullett> it is on the website sherri
<sherri> i went to amazon
<gary fullett> I am aformer floor memebr of the chicago Mercantile exchange i the S and P 500 pit
<gary fullett> I was on the floor for the 87 crash
<gary fullett> my website sherri
<gary fullett> I have worked with many prominet traders that you may have read about
<gary fullett> I am presently a branch manager of a brokerage firm in chicago
User [mike /171.223.220.216] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:13:01 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> actually 32 miles south west of chicago
<gary fullett> I believ ein the principles of one of the first tchnical trader
<gary fullett> his name was richrad d wyckoff
<gary fullett> many of the vendors you see today
<gary fullett> Larry willian Ken Roberts ect..
<gary fullett> have taken his material in one form of another
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> His Principles are based on volume and price action
<Guest> <Enter Text Here>
<gary fullett> I repeat ..
<gary fullett> It is based on Volume and price action
<jack> 
<mrj> 
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> He NEVER follows news
<gary fullett> wyckoff students
<gary fullett> watch the markets action to determine a trade
<gary fullett> As always there is ALWAYS a RISK in trading commodities
<gary fullett> but with wyckoff we try to minmize the risk
<gary fullett> There is No Holy Grail but with wyckoff
<gary fullett> you can understand markets behavior
<gary fullett> so NEVER watch the News
User [Peggy /206.173.161.77] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:16:47 EDT 2000
<mrj> wb peggy
<Peggy> try it again
<gary fullett> you can determine markets direction by using the tecnical approach according to yckoff principle
<gary fullett> any questions so far?
<sherri> n
<gary fullett> does this makes sense?
<jack> yes
<gary fullett> I will go very slow so everyone can understand
<gary fullett> please dont be bored
<mike> y
<gary fullett> it will all come together
<gary fullett> Mike please ask
<mike> ok
<gary fullett> mike question?
<mike> not yet lol
<gary fullett> okay....
<gary fullett> There are 2 principles that you must understand
<gary fullett> 1)
<gary fullett> effort vs result
<gary fullett> 2) cause and effect..
<gary fullett> lets take effort vs result first
<gary fullett> it states:
<gary fullett> that a market result will be affected by its effort
<Dene> 
<jack> 
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> so if a market is going up or down
<gary fullett> its result is deterined
<mrj> 
<gary fullett> by the effort
<gary fullett> so if beans have a volume of 20 thousand contracts
<gary fullett> and it goes up 5 cents
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> the next day
<Guest> 
<gary fullett> the market goes up 2 censt
<gary fullett> cents
<gary fullett> on 20 thouusand contracts
<mike> 
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> so on one day we see that the market moved up 5 cents
<gary fullett> then next day it moved up 2 cents
<gary fullett> but the volume was the same
<gary fullett> one would have expected
<gary fullett> the same result
<gary fullett> with the same volume....
<gary fullett> so you understand this?
<gary fullett> does this make sense?
<sherri> y
<gary fullett> questions?
<Guest> y
<Peggy> y
<gary fullett> so the result was differnt
<gary fullett> but the effort ( volume) was the same)
<jack> but the volume might have different % of sellers and buyers wouldnt it
User [Name already in use /209.190.43.142] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:26:15 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> I will explain this Jack in a few miutes
<gary fullett> good question
User [Jeradatar /209.82.119.108] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:26:25 EDT 2000
<jack> ok
<gary fullett> I promise I will answer all questions...
<gary fullett> so we see the first principle
User [Name already in use] left forum at Mon Apr 03 19:27:10 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> I will refer to this principles
<gary fullett> many times
User [Fritz /209.190.43.142] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:27:46 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> cause vs effect
<gary fullett> markets need fuel to mobve up or down
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> they dont just go up or down will nilly
<gary fullett> they need time to prepare for a pending move
<gary fullett> so the need a cause
<gary fullett> by cause I mean a trading range
<gary fullett> a time to prepare
<gary fullett> the longer that a market prepares for a move
<gary fullett> the longer that that move will
<gary fullett> be
<gary fullett> cause vs effect
<Fritz> What comprises the preparation?
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> the ciuase ( trading range) will lead to an effect wither a rally or a break
<gary fullett> good question
<gary fullett> it is the trading range...
<gary fullett> I will tell you now who prepares for the pending move
<gary fullett> This is a VERY Important what I am about to say
<gary fullett> it is very important that you FULLY understand this
<gary fullett> okay....?
<sherri> y
<jack> ok
<Peggy> y
<Fritz> ok
<mike> ok
<gary fullett> Wyckoff describe the people
<gary fullett> who run campiagns
<gary fullett> or make the preparation for a move as Composiye Man
<gary fullett> composite
<gary fullett> Composite Man
<gary fullett> CM for short
<gary fullett> who is the CM is it one man>?
<mike> just who are they?
<gary fullett> No it is an aggregate
User [Jimbo /63.10.172.194] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:32:31 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> of many of the great minds together
<mrj> hi jimbo
<Peggy> hey Jimbo
<gary fullett> Like Cargil, George Soros
<gary fullett> Merilyy Lynch
<Jimbo> Did class start early?
<gary fullett> Jogn Tudor Jones
<mrj> beginner's class
<gary fullett> begginers class till 8pm Jimbo
<sherri> beginner class j
<Jimbo> ok thx
<gary fullett> so it is the combination of all the great minds
<gary fullett> and the great traders in the world
User [chris /63.15.181.148] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 19:33:45 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> :the poeple in the know"
<gary fullett> the insiders....
<mike> tey are working together/
<mike> ?
<gary fullett> it is Not one person but an agrreagate
<gary fullett> of people who :know the news before it happens
<gary fullett> yes Mike to a degree they are
<gary fullett> Does everyone undersatnds what I said so far about the Composite amn
<gary fullett> any questions
<jack> y
<sherri> y
<mike> ok
<Jeradatar> you bet
<Fritz> y
<Guest> 
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> please stop me if it doesnt make sense or you donrt understand
<Fritz> It is an intelligent consensus...........
<gary fullett> example to you of a CM is OPEC
<sherri> in grains we call them commercials?
<gary fullett> everyone knows who OPEC is?
<jack> y
<mike> y
<gary fullett> CM can be commercials but not always..
<sherri> y
<Fritz> y
<sherri> k
<Peggy> People, hit the enter button every 8 minutes or so or you will get kicked off the chat room.
<gary fullett> but certainly the larger commercials are
<gary fullett> thnk you peggy
<chris> <Enter Text Here>
<gary fullett> Before I forget
<Jeradatar> wondered why I was booted
<gary fullett> on my website is the wyckoff wave you will all need this for wednesday class
<Fritz> 
<sherri> k
<Peggy> k
<gary fullett> if you cant retreive it write to support@ltg-trading.com
<mrj> see you'll at 8:00
<gary fullett> so lets reviwe for a minute
User [mrj] left forum at Mon Apr 03 19:38:37 EDT 2000
<sherri> k mrj
<gary fullett> we have 2 principles
<gary fullett> we have Richard D Wyckoff 
<gary fullett> a trader that deals with only price action and volume
<gary fullett> NO NEWS
<mike> never?
<gary fullett> NEVER
<gary fullett> the Cm knows the news
<gary fullett> by watching market action or the 'tape:
<mike> before me
<gary fullett> by the time u hear the news too late generally
<mike> ok
<jack> i have heard that
<sherri> true
<gary fullett> most vendors today use wyckoff stuff in one way or another
<gary fullett> has anyone heard of volume?
<gary fullett> anyone use volume in analysis>?
<sherri> y
<sherri> y
<Jeradatar> y
<Fritz> y
<Peggy> y
<jack> a little
<Guest> y
<gary fullett> well when I explain volume
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> it will probably be different than the way that you have used it in the past
<gary fullett> may I ask a question?
<sherri> y
<Fritz> y
<mike> ok
<jack> y
<gary fullett> how many people here trade either paper trade or real?
<jack> paper
<Peggy> real
<sherri> real
<mike> both
<Fritz> just started to study
<Guest> r
<gary fullett> the reason I ask
<Jeradatar> paper soon to be real
<gary fullett> is because I want to help teach you how to trade correctly
<gary fullett> and that everthing that you read in the beginning is heklpful for knowledge
<gary fullett> but I have found that is you follow wyckoff you not have to follow anything else to be a knowledgable trader.
<gary fullett> please dont mix methods
<gary fullett> if you think wyckoff is a good tool for u to use than use it
<gary fullett> to me it is the way to look at markets
<gary fullett> There are many systes out there
<gary fullett> all work and all fail
<gary fullett> but the Key to me is to understand
<gary fullett> what the mearket is telling me
<gary fullett> and I do this by price action and volume
<gary fullett> Price action and volume
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> Price action and volume
<gary fullett> I meant to say this 3 times
<gary fullett> when we go over the wyckoff wave I will show you the way a mrkets
<gary fullett> behavior is
<gary fullett> this will be on wednesday
<jack> 
<gary fullett> most people lose money trading commodities
<Fritz> 
<gary fullett> do you know why this is?
<mike> why?
<chris> 
<gary fullett> several reasons
<gary fullett> one they dont have knowledge
<gary fullett> and when they get knowledge they dont have money left
<mike> lol
<gary fullett> they risk more than they should
<mike> almost
<gary fullett> any of u that have traded
<gary fullett> I would imagine
<gary fullett> that if you have lost money in an account
<Fritz> y
<gary fullett> it was due to only sevaeral trades
<gary fullett> that the bulk of your money was lost
<mike> yep
<Peggy> that would be me, all right
<gary fullett> I would say that 80 percent of money lost in an account
<gary fullett> happened on only 20 percent of the trades
<mike> yep
<gary fullett> does that make sense?
<jack> yes
<Fritz> y
<sherri> y
<Peggy> painfully
<gary fullett> Human nature never wants to be wrong
<Jeradatar> 
<gary fullett> s to admit to a losing trade
<gary fullett> is admitting that you are wrong
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> but the first loss is the best loss
<gary fullett> so when you make a trde
<gary fullett> trade
<gary fullett> place a stop
<gary fullett> and an objective
<gary fullett> and the risk to reward should be at least 3 to 1
<gary fullett> that doesn t mean that u will achieve a 3 to 1
<mike> explain
<gary fullett> reward
<gary fullett> but going into the trade that is what the risk to reward should be
<gary fullett> have a plan 
<gary fullett> trade your plan
<gary fullett> and get out if you are wrong..
<gary fullett> as a trader one should know immediatly
<gary fullett> if they are right or wrong a trade..
<gary fullett> if you buy support
<gary fullett> and the market continues to go down
<gary fullett> you are probably wrong
<gary fullett> GET out of the Market 
<gary fullett> Dont Hope that you are right
<gary fullett> or the market "will come back"
<gary fullett> by using wyckoff
<gary fullett> you will see with price action and volume
<gary fullett> what the intentions
<gary fullett> of the CM are
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> this will generally keep you out of majotr damage
<jack> 
<gary fullett> yet there is ALWAYS RISK
<gary fullett> questions?
<Peggy> 
<Guest> 
<jack> no
<Fritz> n
<gary fullett> by the way anyone cam email me questions or call me toll free if they would like individual help
<Fritz> thank you
<gary fullett> the Composite mans role:
<gary fullett> is to prepare for a pending move
<gary fullett> he does this within a trading range
<gary fullett> he doesnt like company
<gary fullett> so as he prepares trades
<gary fullett> get nickeled and dime
<gary fullett> they get chopped up..
<gary fullett> i HAVE A GREAT EXAMPLE FOR U
<gary fullett> sorry about the caps
<gary fullett> the NASDAQ
<gary fullett> has anyone watched it recently?
<jack> y
<gary fullett> Monday thru Friday last week
<mike> big loss
<Guest> y
<gary fullett> it was lower right
<gary fullett> ?
<jack> y
<Guest> y
<gary fullett> so everyone was bearish on Friday as the market was going for another big loss
<gary fullett> the CM saw this so what did he do?
<gary fullett> he conducted a BIG rAlly
<gary fullett> on friday to get the shorts out
<gary fullett> and what happened today
<gary fullett> after the people got out of their shorts last friday
<mike> biggest loss
<jack> big lose
<gary fullett> big day down today
<gary fullett> the rally was conducted
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> by the CM to get the shorts out
<gary fullett> he doesnt like comapny
<chris> 
<gary fullett> it is his job to confuse
<gary fullett> fellow traders
<gary fullett> thill the end
<gary fullett> and I will exaplin this more later on how he does it
<gary fullett> I didnt get too much into class tonight 
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> as I wanted to give you backround
<gary fullett> of me and wyckoff
<gary fullett> and the basics
<mike> good class
<jack> so far so good
<gary fullett> I will be going more into this on wednesday
<Jeradatar> 
<gary fullett> please download the wyckoff wave
<gary fullett> we will be going into how a markets acts
<gary fullett> on wednesday
<gary fullett> with this wave
<gary fullett> as I mentioned earlier
<gary fullett> for people that have been in this class for a few months
<gary fullett> now we have a class at 8pm
<gary fullett> in 2 minutes
<gary fullett> eveyone is welcome to stay
<gary fullett> it is a tad more advanced
User [Jimbo /63.10.172.194] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:00:14 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> but one day we will all be on the same level
<gary fullett> hopefully great traders
<gary fullett> I will stop the beginners class now
<gary fullett> but before I do
<sherri> thx gary
<gary fullett> are htere any questions?
<gary fullett> on wyckoff trading or in general?
<Guest> thanks
<jack> no, thanks gary
<gary fullett> it gets better but I need backround first
User [Guest] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:01:14 EDT 2000
User [Gordy /63.88.62.88] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:01:18 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> so we all have solid footing...
User [mrj /206.251.171.223] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:01:33 EDT 2000
<sherri> gary...do I order the book from you?
<gary fullett> This concludes the beginners class 
<mrj> <Enter Text Here>
<gary fullett> it will be oin the archive if anyone would like to review
User [lmarsh /12.14.197.187] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:01:56 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> in the next class we talk markets and a whole gambit of wyckoff
<mrj> hey marsh
<sherri> hi m and m
<gary fullett> please stay.. I think it will be helpful....
<mrj> :0
<lmarsh> god evening all
User [SteveF /209.214.194.96] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:02:27 EDT 2000
<Peggy> 
<mrj> oHi steve
User [Jeff /24.17.169.192] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:02:36 EDT 2000
User [fibo /204.119.225.161] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:02:40 EDT 2000
<jack> 
<gary fullett> I will take a break for 2 minutes:
User [mike] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:02:41 EDT 2000
<sherri> and a prayerful evening to you too marsh
<Jimbo> hiyall
<mrj> hi fibo jeff
<SteveF> Howdy Folks
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> and I will be back
<sherri> hi fibo
<gary fullett> thank you for your time...
<fibo> hello everyone
<Jeff> Hello All
<lmarsh> oops misspelled again(not my strong point) good to see you too sheri
User [jack] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:03:20 EDT 2000
<sherri> hi everyone
<fibo> brb
<sherri> ;-) marsh
User [sal /206.175.231.61] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:03:56 EDT 2000
<mrj> hi sal
<sherri> hi my gal sal
<sal> hi
<lmarsh> Good post you put up SteveF, it seems so true!
<lmarsh> hi sal, 
<sherri> great post steve and mrj
<gary fullett> Good evening everyone
User [Guest /209.82.119.108] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:04:36 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> I hope yu all had a great weekend
<sal> one eye on screen, one on game
<gary fullett> score?
<Gordy> Go Gators
<sherri> go MICHIGAN
User [Jeradatar] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:05:01 EDT 2000
<mrj> hey gordy
<gary fullett> Go Purdue:
User [Tom /147.72.69.187] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:05:06 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> :)
<Gordy> Hi All
User [Guest] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:05:13 EDT 2000
<sal> go team Purdue beat
<SteveF> Thanks
<gary fullett> first thank you for all the postings I think it is great
<lmarsh> Florida sure looks good
<sherri> boooooo!
<lmarsh> run & gun
<Gordy> First ever time in the big one
<gary fullett> Amos will be conducting
<gary fullett> the class
<gary fullett> about accumaultion
User [Tom] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:06:42 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> but I will start
<sherri> he must know my husband....never throws anything away
User [Tom /147.72.69.187] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:06:56 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> before I begin any questions?
<gary fullett> about wyckoff or in general
<sal> :) @sherri
<gary fullett> tmorrow night we will be talking about grains
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> and some other interesting markets
<gary fullett> I will be sending a chart tomorrow
User [eric /206.98.11.182] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:07:45 EDT 2000
User [amos /62.0.146.151] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:07:51 EDT 2000
<sherri> hi e
<mrj> hi eric
<fibo> 
<gary fullett> but a chart that looks wonderful to me is the assuie dollar
<sherri> hi amos
<lmarsh> hi amos, fibo, eric
<Jimbo> eric, amos
<gary fullett> appears to be alot of accumaltion
<chris> 
<gary fullett> I will send the daily tomorrow
<fibo> hi amos
<amos> hi
<Peggy> hi, Amos
<eric> good evening to all
User [jack /63.29.105.28] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:08:32 EDT 2000
<mrj> check out monthly on aussie dollar
<sherri> brb
<Peggy> good class tonight, Gary
<eric> 
<gary fullett> I try peggy,,,
<gary fullett> I will be sending this tomorrow
<sal> wow, i even noticed that this weekend
<gary fullett> so I dont want to discuss
<gary fullett> it yet but it is very interesting...
<gary fullett> questions?
<gary fullett> okay lets begin
<sherri> 
<jack> 
<gary fullett> I want to talk about horizonatl support and resisatnce
User [davep /24.147.119.114] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:11:04 EDT 2000
<mrj> hi dave
<gary fullett> this to me is very unique
<fibo> hi
<gary fullett> and if you look at it from the stand point of support being the floor
<gary fullett> and the resistance being the ceiling
<davep> hui mrj, fibo . . .<Enter Text Here>
<gary fullett> and in between the trading range that is contained in it
<gary fullett> for now on I will be drawing more clearly and more defined
<gary fullett> horizonatl support and resistance lines
User [Guest /209.190.43.7] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:13:15 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> as I have mentioned many times
<gary fullett> one never know how many times
<gary fullett> a market will test support or resiatnce
User [Guest] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:13:39 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> this is why it is very importat
<sal> 
<gary fullett> that at the bottom of the range and the top of the range
<gary fullett> you watch the volume
<gary fullett> and price action
User [fritz /209.190.43.7] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:14:06 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> if you see at the top of a range 
<Gordy> 
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> that the price action is getting smaller
<gary fullett> and the volume is large
<gary fullett> this probably means that a jump over the creek will occur
<lmarsh> 
<amos> 
<gary fullett> but it is important to watch the action at those 2 levels
<Jeff> 
<fritz> 
<gary fullett> I watch the spreads
<gary fullett> and option pricing
<jack> 
<gary fullett> to see w aht the Cm wants to do
<Peggy> can we track the CM through spread as well as futures?
<gary fullett> sometimes spreads will give u a great clue as to a break out
<gary fullett> like meal -oil spreads in the bean cmpllex
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> yes peggy
<sal> how do you track option pricing? just nearby atm? check volume on them too?
<gary fullett> yes..
<eric> 
<gary fullett> let say beans are up 2 cents
<sherri> 
<fritz> 
<gary fullett> but a call option is up nicely as well
<Peggy> can you explain a scenario at the top of a trading range and option spreads
<mrj> 
<gary fullett> this means heavy buying of calls
<gary fullett> so if you an increase numbers of calls
<gary fullett> near or at the money
<gary fullett> at the top of the range this could mean a jump over the creek
<fibo> 
<gary fullett> or if the futures are oing up and the calls are not moving up
<gary fullett> this could mean that the rally will fial
<gary fullett> you canactauly chart option prices too
<gary fullett> today for example
<gary fullett> the 240 corn call
<gary fullett> was up only about 1 1 /2 cents
<gary fullett> when the corn was up 4 censts
<gary fullett> this to me meant that corn would break today.
<gary fullett> the point being
<sal> what should it have moved 2 cents?
<gary fullett> is that if you watch spreads options and price actio and volume
<gary fullett> at the top of a horizonatl range
<gary fullett> you can sometimes tell better if you will get a jump over the creek
<gary fullett> or a break thru the ice,,
<sherri> 
<jack> 
<fritz> 
<gary fullett> yes sal or more
<davep> 
<sal> m
<SteveF> 
<Tom> 
<lmarsh> 
<gary fullett> does this make sense? any questions?
<fibo> y
<Jimbo> y,n
<sherri> uh huh
<fritz> y
<lmarsh> makes sense
<Jeff> y
<eric> why price range is smaller at the top of the range for jOC?
<gary fullett> I know ther eis laot to watch and track but
<chris> y
<gary fullett> it is important in order to get an edge.
<gary fullett> questions?
<fritz> what are the various scenarios of volume, price, options-- to determine up or down
<gary fullett> watch the volume and price action especailly at the top of a trading range
<gary fullett> as well as the bottom of the range
<gary fullett> fritz that is a good question
<amos> 
<gary fullett> but would require a very long answer
<fritz> thank you
<fritz> understood
<gary fullett> nd I will be going over the volume price action in beginers
<gary fullett> class over the next few weeks
<gary fullett> I will expalin this to you
<gary fullett> okay?
<fritz> ok
<Dene> y
<gary fullett> I wont forget about ya
<fritz> thanks
<gary fullett> if there are no other questiosn
<jack> 
<gary fullett> I will defer to amos
<gary fullett> to talk about accumaltion
<gary fullett> and the rest of the wave
<gary fullett> amos if you please...
<mrj> 
<amos> first, thank for all the contributions on the post
<Peggy> 
<gary fullett> for the new people here amos has been trading for over 22 years
<gary fullett> and is a CTA
<amos> Did every one read the excellent manipulation stuff?
<gary fullett> and is a greta believe rof wyckoff
<sal> y
<lmarsh> y
<eric> y
<sherri> y
<Peggy> yes, it was great
<fibo> y
<fritz> some
<amos> any comment on the concept of manipulation?
<gary fullett>-><Dene> are you able to follow this? please click on private in the right corner to respond
<gary fullett>-><Dene> welcome to class
<lmarsh> viscous
<sherri> wyckoff was right
<gary fullett> he usually is sherri
<jack> where can I read the manipulation stuff?
<fibo> necessary for economic survival
<amos> well, the whole point is that the WYckoff interpretation of makret action is nothing more
<SteveF> we accept manipulation as fact and work within those bounderies.
<amos> than the deciphering of ONE TYPE OF MANIPULATION.
<lmarsh> well said steve
<amos> that is basically all there is to it.
<sal> 
<amos> The manipulation goes on all the time, on all time frames.
<amos> What Wyckoff did is isolate one situation where the manipulative process becomes a little
<amos> more clear ( I call it the footstpes of the CM are clearer) and he advised to trade this
<amos> particular phenomenon.
<amos> You know that there are at least 300 systems that try
<amos> to capture a move in the market that has a higher than 50% probability.
<amos> Bollinger bands, Keltner, Taylor, Welles Wilder various oscillators etc.
<amos> everyone swears by their method.
<jack> 
<Gordy> 
<sherri> 
<fibo> 
<mrj> 
<SteveF> 
<fritz> 
<Peggy> 
<amos> Wyckoff simply understood that if you can identify the process of manipulation
<eric> 
<chris> 
<sal> 
<amos> in a more clearer fasion
<amos> you have a small chance.
<amos> I happened to watch today Lilnda Bradford Raschke open chat room
<amos> Apparently once a month she and the Moore research center have an open house policy.
<amos> There were all the time between 150 and 198 "listners"
<amos> She t"talks " all day.
<amos> (She is a wonderful typist!!!)
<amos> then at the end she talks for another 1 1/2 hours.
<Dene> 
<Peggy> is she worth listening to Amos?
<amos> You know what? she found that a salad of Wyckoff, Taylor, a few momentum indicators
<amos> and a few inventions of her own (every painter/artist wants to immortalize their style)
<amos> and beyond all-- she understands manipulation.
<amos> I cannot answer this Peggy. I have to digest. I coppied most of the stuff and I need to read it
<amos> a few times to separate the chaff from the Wheat.
<davep> 
<amos> But she is basically a WYckoff person.
<fritz> 
<jack> 
<amos> Only the she looks at the 1 and 5 minutes all day and trades large lots of s and ps
<amos> What we are trying to do here--is rather simple.
<amos> We talk about , basically, the daily time fram of manipulation.
<amos> So if we go back to the first 8 starts on the Manipulation chart (the 4 phases of the market)
<Jeff> 
<amos> we agreed that the first star is the Preliminary support; the second was the the rally and the resistance of the PS. We said that this rally point is significant
<Tom> Where do we read about manipulation??
<amos> Why? because it represents the potntial
<amos> (tom go to SteveF post on ltg)
<mrj> Check "posy" on this site
<Tom> ok
<mrj> post
<amos> point of the coming range that will delineate the boundaries
<amos> of the daily accumulation process.
<amos> Star # 3 is the selling climax.
<amos> I mentioned last time that it is a very rough schmatic
<fritz> How do you analyse that point?
<amos> the form of the relationship between the PS and the SC can
<lmarsh> large volume & large price range, fritz
User [jack] left forum at Mon Apr 03 20:38:06 EDT 2000
<amos> take many forms. The spread in prices between them can be very wide or it can be small
<amos> No two markets are the same. It depends to a large extent--WHAT TERNSPIRED before.A
<amos> Is it a market that had been marked down for months, years, weeks?
<amos> is the markdown sharp or shallow?
User [Randy /209.130.164.127] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:39:12 EDT 2000
<Dene> 
<davep> 
<SteveF> 
<Gordy> 
<amos> Each market situation will call for a slightly different methodology by the CM.
<sal> 
<fibo> 
<amos> The important point is that once stars 1-2-3 are identified (kindly do not mix these with Ken Roberts 1-2-3 thingy)
<amos> you have a pretty good idea of where the CM stands.
<sherri> 
<amos> Now come stars 4-8 which
<amos> comprise the process of accumulation.
<amos> Lets us repeat what accumulation means:
User [Jimbo /63.10.172.194] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:41:02 EDT 2000
<amos> It is the buying by smart money for the purpose of rasing prices.
<amos> I hate the concept of buying low and selling high. Because accumulation that happens at higher levels in a corrective phase of a markup
<amos> is buying high in order to go higher.
<amos> You never know what is low and what is high.
<amos> Beans at 550 are high or low?
<sherri> l
<amos> We tend to always compare prices to recent levels.
<fritz> ??
<amos> This is deadly in the market
<amos> fritz ask a little more specifcially?
<fritz> nothing, sorry
<amos> that is ok
<amos> it is deadly because when you say something is high or low--you put yourself in the shoes of
<amos> the CM. WE are not.
<amos> It is true that once you have enough data points for a certain commodity
<amos> then you have a much better chance of attributing the adjective "high" or "low " to price.
<mrj> 
<amos> But when you want to buy or sell-- you want to buy THE LOW and sell THE high.
<Gordy> 
<amos> On the way to this coveted secret--there are many lows and highs.
<Peggy> 
<amos> So I prefer not to use the term low and high.
<eric> 
<amos> But if you have support and resistance--you are saying that these are levels that have a good
<sal> 
<amos> chance that the CM will also buy and sell around them.
<SteveF> 
<amos> I will repeat-- support and resistance are levels where the CM may buy and sell too.
<fritz> 
<amos> If he does not--the market will not stop there.
User [gary fullett /171.208.27.87] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 20:46:46 EDT 2000
<Jimbo> 
<amos> You and I do not fix support and resistance. It is the more knowledgeable forces of the market that do.
<amos> We are trying to identify their intentions.
<Jeff> 
<amos> It so happens that stars 1 and 3 are very likely points where the CM will continue to buy during the process
<fibo> 
<amos> of accumulation.
<amos> I will say more than that:
<sherri> 
<lmarsh> 
<Peggy> 
<amos> These stars are the secret language by which the CM is communicatin with his friends.
<amos> They say that in the beginning of the last century--the big guys had secret signlas they used
<fritz> 
<amos> to put in a scripted format in certain new papers in New York .
<chris> 
<amos> If you read a small announcemt in the calssified ads, for example--that said:
<amos> A 5 year old child is looking for his lost puppy, for example--you knew the market is going up that day.
<amos> I have no way to prove this.
<lmarsh> : )
<amos> But certain market behavior is definitely a signal to informed forces to act.
<amos> There are many old traders that follow old rules of projecting highs and lows for the next day, week, month.
<fibo> very interesting
<amos> These methods are still used by very intelligent system develpers (such as Rodinonde)
<sal> 
<amos> The point here is that stars 1 and 3 are more important poinst of support that others.
<fritz> 
<amos> By using these points as reference--you eliminate a lot of the noise that exists in the market
<amos> if you draw horizontal lines at these two stars--you will notice that they are repsected more
<amos> than other levels of support.
<amos> A spring of the PS and and upthrust of the PLS are one of the best trading signals I know.
<amos> The trouble is that these are ttwo points.
<amos> We want to trade every day and we are looking for more points of support and resistance to
<amos> enter the market.
<amos> I have no problem with this.
<amos> ONLY that these two points have a much higher predictive power. thats all.
<amos> Any quesitons so far?
<mrj> 
<Peggy> 
<sherri> 
<fritz> n
<lmarsh> no, please continue
<amos> Please, I am not really asking you a question, I just give you a chance to refresh your screen
<fibo> 
<Jimbo> 
<sal> 
<Jeff> 
<amos> I will say it: lol
<eric> 
<gary fullett> 
<SteveF> for anyone new the stars amos refers to are from a small chart on SMI website.
<gary fullett> Steve, I think this may be a tad over the beginners levels since I didnt give bakround
<amos> So now we get to star 5. It is a test of the SC which confirms it as being a selling climax
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> but this chart can be found there
<amos> (this allusion to small reminds me certain perspective visual aberations men have about certain
<gary fullett> I will be expalining this to the beginner in class in the weeks to come
<amos> organs when they look at them from a certain distance, but thatis another story)
<SteveF> lol
<mrj> lol
<amos> It is NOT a small chart, by any means.
<amos> now we get to star 6.
<davep> 
<amos> this is a cheater.
<amos> why? because this (small) chart is completely oblivious to time!
<amos> If star number 6 occurs fairly close in time to star 3--then it is an easy trade.
<fritz> 
<amos> If it is very far--sothat you actually have to look at the weeklychart in order to identify it--we have a problem.
<amos> Our analysis of the wheat chart on teh weekly should have explained this point.
<amos> You can see whatever you want on the daily-0-but if the accumulation is long term--then the 
<gary fullett> 
<amos> IMPOERTANT stars appear on teh WEEKLY, not on the daily.
<eric> 
<amos> Here is the point. THese stars are correct. They describe a very distinct manipulative act on part of the CM.
<amos> But since time is one of the elements the CM uses to manipuloate--we DO NOT KNOW
<amos> on what time fram he is working at any given moment.
<amos> Whatr shuld we do?????
<Jeff> Amos, Why did you call star 6 a cheater?
<amos> I am explaining this very point now
<Jeff> OK
<lmarsh> buy @ support with a protective stop close to the selling climax, aka star #3
<amos> star 6 is the BEST place to buy. You avoid the accumulation process, your stop never gets caught. You are able to buy calls that may not expire....
<amos> on and on.
<amos> But the problem is that many times star 6 is on a chart that DOES NOT show you star 1
<amos> .
<amos> The answer , at least, here, is simple--you must look at more than one time frame.
<amos> If the CM tries to cheat us with time-- we must--as a preventive measure--study TIME harder.
<amos> We must be aware of the possibilities that time is being manipulated.
<amos> Now, it so happens that SMI gets paid to teach you this.
<amos> Everyone wants to make things look easy and palatable i n order to attract
<amos> customers.
<fibo> 
<amos> You are not going to sell someone a product by sating to them:
<amos> Listen , this stinks.
<sherri> 
<fritz> 
<mrj> 
<eric> 
<Dene> 
<amos> But I am telling you , here, as stark and as ugly as it sounds-- star 6 as wishful
<Peggy> 
<amos> and alluring as it is--is not that easy to attain.
<amos> However, those who strive to attain it--can make money.
<amos> The various apparitions of star 6 can be a very long subject of many classes and many examples.
<sal> 
<amos> I remember, when I used to teach an advanced Wyckoff class at the CME--that was the most we spent time on.
User [chris /63.15.181.136] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 21:07:37 EDT 2000
<amos> But, it is sufficient for you to understand that--it can take many shapes and forms.
<sherri> can you give us a list of examples?
<amos> If you are prepared to its abilityy to knife--you are already a better warrior.
<amos> I will give one hypothetical example, sherri.
<sherri> thx
<amos> If the distance (in price) between star4 and 6 is large-- you are alwyas tempted to get in as soon
<amos> as you recognized the selling climax--because you are afriad that the market will "fly" without you.
<amos> The truth is that you never know at what level star 6 will be places by the CM.
<amos> If your risk between star 4 and 6 is larger than your money management will allow--you will never be able to get in.
<gary fullett>-><sal> 
<amos> If you do get in (that is enought suckers)--the CM, who monitors open interest and knows exactly how many contracts he is long and who and what is the financial power
<gary fullett>-><sal> 
<gary fullett> 
<amos> of the people that stand agains him--will make a decision0-whether to let you in, or get your stop.
<amos> What if star 6 is a terminal shakeout?
<gary fullett> can u explain a terminal shakeout amos
<gary fullett> for class
<gary fullett> briefly
<amos> that meant it can go much deeper than the selling climax for a very short while (ONe nithe, say)
<amos> Then you can be very right about the general analysis--and stand there holding nothing in your hand
<amos> or worse than that.
<fritz> 
<SteveF> 
<amos> It is possible that the run up and down in teh yen Friday and today was such a manufactured shake out of shorts.
<fibo> 
<amos> Pity the shorts who tried it.
<amos> However, if we are lucky enough to identify a rather easy from
<amos> of accumulation and star 6 did not shake us out--then stars 7 and 8 have quite typical behavior
User [eric /206.98.11.157] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 21:14:07 EDT 2000
<sal> 
<amos> the reaction to star 8 MUST be on lighter volume. It will represent lack of supply on that last test.
<amos> 
<davep> 
<chris> <Enter Text Here>
<amos> Now the move from start 8 to 9 is not as simple as the "small" chart describes.
User [Jimbo /63.10.172.194] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 21:15:14 EDT 2000
<amos> It can have a sign of strength, that is another push to the upper boundary of the accumulation band
<Jeff> Amos, What is the shortest time frame you have seen the 1-8 star formation develop?
<amos> and another light volume test in the range and only after that a jump
<amos> Jeff I cannot answer this. This behvior repeats itself on the 1 minute bar charts!!
<amos> but we are talking here about the daily chart.
<amos> However, Jeff's q. has merit--it is significant to understand that this principle replicates
<amos> itself on all time frames.
<amos> In one form or another.
<sherri> 
<gary fullett> jeff it happens on a minute chart as well as a monthly chart'
<gary fullett> it happens constantly
<sherri> brb
<amos> it does not occur all the time--but when you see it on the 15; 30;60 minutes--you can use the same logic.
<gary fullett> but remeber oon a 1 minute chart the reaction is small
<amos> This is where the concept of "testing" comes from.
<amos> 
<amos> so the transition from star 8 to 9 is rather simplified on thi
<amos> this schematic. But it involves, mmore often than not--a sign of strength.
<fritz> 
<amos> This is vigorous upsurge of wide movement and large volume.
<Peggy> 
<lmarsh> 
<amos> Why do you think that is allowed?
<fibo> so the public will jump on board
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> how are you?
<fibo> CM wants it recognized
<Jimbo>-><gary fullett> good, how bout you?
<mrj> advertisement
<amos> yes fibo, i am looking for one more word
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> good
<fibo> demand
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> r u able to understand?
<sherri> cause
<fibo> mark up
<sal> 
<amos> no, supercalifragialistic....docious
<Jimbo>-><gary fullett> oh yeah! quite easily!
<fibo> lol
<lmarsh> lol
<amos> no. What Happens after star 6 is that the CM has accumulated
<amos> his postion.
<amos> Until now he had to lie to us and lure us to sell.
<amos> Now that he has his postion--he welcomes the public to buy and help him with the markup.
<Jimbo> so he is manufacturing demand to aid markup
<amos> The manipuoative process to sell--has ended--nnow starts the campaign for the public to buy.
<amos> You may say. AMOS!!!!
<fibo> that is what i said
<amos> yes you may say that.
<amos> You may say that it is too easy, and why let the public buy so low???
<amos> This is again an allusion.
<amos> Most of us bought at stars 1234
<amos> we have already been shaken out, we are disgusted, we are frustrated, we thing the market will never go up
<sal> amos, didn't you say the other day there is a gret trader who waits for 8
<amos> There is a funny chart of the psychology of the average Joe (Have you noticed that no one in this class has the name of Joe???0
<amos> in James Dines book.
<amos> I used it from time to time.
<amos> But by the time star 9 comes00we all want to SELL not to buy.
<fritz> 
<Peggy> 
<amos> Of course, the Rothcilds and the Steinhardts of the world--bypass all this and they buy star
<amos> 10.
<mrj> 
<sherri> 
<amos> What is the biggest problem and the biggest asset of start 10, please?
<davep> 
<fibo> risk
<eric>-><mrj> may not have a star 10
<amos> right, risk is rather high. But probability is high too.
<SteveF> market apears to be going down.
User [Dene /207.50.1.174] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 21:26:27 EDT 2000
<amos> you exchange high probability for higher risk.
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> 
<gary fullett> 
<amos> All of a sudden you turn from a buyer of insurance to an insurance company.
<sal> 
<amos> It is much harder to buy at point 10. But it has a much better chance of making you money.
<amos> This is why I like the thrust method.
<amos> You should never buy after star 10 with the thinking you have to protect below star 6 or 3.
<amos> You should look, on the daily chart, in our case for a higher high, put a stop below the last low--and go with it.
<amos> Why is this good?
<Dene> 
<amos> Becuase you have already observed that the process of accumulation TOOK place.
<amos> You know that behing you is a large effort by the CM and he did not wast all his time and money
<amos> during stars 1-8 just to go a short distance. You also, according to WYckoff have a point and gifure chart that
<gary fullett> 
<amos> measrued the AMOUNT of energy (gas in your tank) the CM invested in the next move and you are
<amos> jumping on a moving car.
<amos> This is also agood place to buy calls. Even if they are alittle dear. this is where volatility will carry the day.
<amos> 
<eric> 
<amos> The process of stars 10 to 13 is the marke up.
<amos> We shall leave it for another day (or 60 minutes, or week etc.)
<amos> haoook
<fritz> 
<sherri> 
<Peggy> lol
<Jeff> 
<chris> 
<SteveF> lol..thanks amos
<Dene> 
<lmarsh> thanks
<fibo> thanks amos
<chris> thank you amos
<davep> thanks amos
<amos> any questions?
<mrj> thanks good instruction
<fritz> thanks amos
<eric> thanks
<Dene> thanks a lot amos
<Jimbo>-><gary fullett> thanx muchly
<Jeff> thanks amos, great tutorial
<Peggy> thank you amos
<amos> ask questions, stop thanking me
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> i am glad that u r learning thwn when u trade again u make money
<lmarsh> When you buy on the "upthrust", do you actually buy on the retest of the "upthrust"?
<sal> 
<amos> don't understnad the q lmarsh
<Jimbo>-><gary fullett> yeah, now just need a little time to put a plan together
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> take your time
<lmarsh> sorry, you've mentioned in past of buying on the upthrust. Is this in fact, or do you sometimes wait & buy the retest?
<amos> what do you call upthrust?
<SteveF> amos doesn't buy on "the upthrust" he buys "an" upthrust after accumultion.
<Jimbo>-><gary fullett> can you recommend a couple of markets for me to take a look at for medium(3-7 day) trading?
<gary fullett> I think what he is referring to
<gary fullett> right steve
<lmarsh> yes
<gary fullett>-><Jimbo> beans
<amos> I am sorry, in Wyckoff terms upthrust is the opposite of spring. In what phase of the market are you talking about?
<chris> where can i find smi website for chart please?
<lmarsh> say after the JOC
<SteveF> "thrust"
<amos> chris there is none to my knowledge, but you are in one
<Peggy> Chris, I believe there is a reference to it on the posts
<amos> sorry, you said chart, i read chat, sorry
<SteveF> lol
<sherri> chris, on this site are wyckoff terms that amos put up that you should copy off also
<Jeff> What (if anything) can one do to avoid a terminal shakeout when buying at star 6?
<sal> 
<eric> What is the significant of star 2? Is it the boundary too? Amos
<amos> it is on the post somewhere.
<gary fullett> there is a glossary of wyckoff terms on this site
<gary fullett> as well as a wyckoff wave
<fibo> the way i understand it is that he would buy a new high over 9 with stop under 10.
<gary fullett> and the chart that amos is referring to is on the smi website
<amos> Jeff you do not avoid anything, you are ready for everything.
<amos> star 2 is very important--it usually is the creek
<Jimbo> SMI=stock market institute
<chris> www.smi.com? what is smi?
<gary fullett> Please remeber seomtimes a spring or an upthrust will stop out the very best traders
<amos> Jump across the creek and upthrust are two different things.
<fritz> Would the recent (pass weeks/months) moves in gold be a good study of these stars?
<amos> Upthrust does not happen after SOS, JOC do.
<gary fullett> it can extend past a point that you dont think it can go
<Peggy> Chris, look on the chat room posts here at gary's site.
<gary fullett> stock market institute Chris
<amos> It is alwyas a ceratain sequence of events.
<chris> thank you sherri, gary,jimbo,peggy
<amos> If something happened--then the Wyckoff philosophy tells you that x,y,z, are likely to happen.
<amos> It is a serial order of events. they rarely change places.
<gary fullett> fritz what do you mean?
<amos> you cannot have a SC before the PS
<amos> you cannot have SOS before tso etc.
<gary fullett> what do you think you see in gold?
<amos> glitter
<sherri> 
<amos> I have not looked
<fritz> That it would be easy to study the Wyckoff ideas on.
<sal> 
<eric> 
<Peggy> 
<fibo> 
<Jimbo> 
<gary fullett> there isnt alot with the gold chart that is like these starts now
<mrj> 
<amos> fritz, the weekly chart of gold would be a fantastic study of these stars
<fritz> Gradual decline over years/months, then a fifty dollar jump.
User [sherri] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:41:25 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> on the daily
<gary fullett> but you need to look at the weekly for this
<fritz> ok
<gary fullett> this can be a sign of dtrenghth in gold
<Dene> 
<gary fullett> this could mmean demand
User [sherri /209.100.190.153] joined forum at Mon Apr 03 21:42:07 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> mean
<gary fullett> good observation
<fritz> the cm are interesting in gold
<amos> Here is a slight varioation
<amos> Gary uses many rallies as a sign of strength
<sal> 
<amos> It seves him well. But it is not Pure Wyckoff.
<lmarsh> 
<amos> Wyckoff said that SOS can happen only once and it is followed by a jump.
<amos> After sos (a classical one) there should not be another retracement--because that will make
<amos> it too easy for even stupid public to jump in very close to a convenient low.
<Jimbo> amos-which star on chart is SOS?
<amos> But-- nothing is wrong in calling a strong rally with wide range in prices and high volume SOS
<gary fullett> I should nt use it as oftene as I do I mean it as demand
<amos> if it helps you trading.
<gary fullett> but I try to relate
<amos> between 8 and 9 Jimbo
<Jimbo> as it breaks resistance of trading range?
<sherri> can't find sos on list?
<amos> You should have seen Linda Rascke calling 1 minute climaxes in the s and p.
<amos> It is redioculous--but she makes mi8llions with these definitions.
<Jimbo> sign of strength
<sherri> k
<davep> 
<fritz> What was the s&p trading range she was working in?
<sal> 
<amos> she is smart tho, she does not call them selling and buying climaxes--she just uses
<SteveF> The "Large and significant' chart with the 21 stars can be found At: http://www.stockmarket.qpg.com/ 
<amos> the term: sell climax and buy climax. Smart lady
<amos> SteveF you are larger than life
<SteveF> :)
<amos> I hope you all understand that this is ONE way to look at the market.
<chris> 
<fritz> yes
<amos> It is NOT a panacea. it is not a holy grail. It is just a grail
<gary fullett> for all the beginners that have joined us tonigth I will be going over all of this in classes
<SteveF> the BEST that I have found.
<gary fullett>-><SteveF> I am glad that you have absorbed this
<chris> thank you steve!
<amos> it is a Bar b que grail
<fibo> thanks Steve
<Jimbo> amos from south israel
<gary fullett>-><SteveF> so please be patient and I will help you and amos too
<amos> yea, lots of grits
<SteveF> you are welcome!
<gary fullett>-><SteveF> diddnt mean that last one sorry
<gary fullett> I hope everyone was able to grasp this tonight
<amos> I lived in Mempis- Iknow Griddley's
<Jimbo> yup!
<gary fullett> it is important part of market analysis
<amos> people who grasp become grasphoppers
<Dene> thanks and goodnight
<gary fullett> :)
User [Dene] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:50:54 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> Dene thank u
<fibo> how about the one just east of the peobody hotel? (rib place)
<gary fullett> tomorrow will be chart time
<Peggy> nite, Dene
<SteveF> Gridleys..Rondevues...and many more.
<gary fullett> r there any charts that anyone finds useful
<Jimbo> Wyckoff simple, but not easy
<fritz> Good night ladies and gentlemen, bedtime here, Thanks again., Memphis the OLD Cotton Exchange building, neat building.
<amos> OY, fibo , such memories, next is Hillary and Ark.....
<Peggy> nite, Fritz
<fritz> nite
<mrj> nite fritz
<fibo> lol@amos
<fibo> nite fritz
User [fritz] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:52:09 EDT 2000
<sal> 
<SteveF> ya'll have a good night and see ya tomorrow!
<fibo> nite Steve
<mrj> nite steve
<amos> bye steve
<Peggy> nite, Steve
<Jimbo> gary-I used to use cot reports a lot, now seem confusing with Wyckoff.
<SteveF> :)
<lmarsh> thanks Steve
<mrj> nite everyone thanks gary and amos
<Jeff> 
<gary fullett> cot
<fibo> nit mrj
<sal> nite mrj
<gary fullett> reports lag too much
User [mrj] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:54:18 EDT 2000
<amos> I am going back to bed too
<Jimbo> seem to contradict acc and distr patterns
<gary fullett> and it doesnt tell the whole story
<fibo> nite amos
<eric>-><eric> gn amos
<Jeff> night all. Thanks again Amos and Gary.
<gary fullett> night amos thank u
<davep> nit amos
User [amos] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:54:39 EDT 2000
User [SteveF] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:54:43 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> they do
<sal> anyone see article in Futures about accuracy of COt?
User [Jeff] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:54:50 EDT 2000
<sherri> good nite and thank you
<eric> yes
User [sherri] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:55:02 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> COT charts if used right can be of help
<Jimbo> which issue sal?
<sal> seems to be market dependent
<sal> most recent issue
<gary fullett> but they are used diffeerntly wyckoff wise
<lmarsh> had'nt read it yet sal.....
<gary fullett> The cm
<gary fullett> can be a commercial can be a large spec
<Jimbo> me either-got to renew
<gary fullett> so the report can be misleadig and confusing
<sal> the yen the COT , commercials are usualll wrong,, in cattle mostly right
<gary fullett> I would use price action and volume
<Jimbo> comm & large spec diametrically opposed according to cot-charts site
<sal> their premise was the commercials are really 2 parts- users, producers
<gary fullett> I wouldnt use them in conjunction with wyckoff
<gary fullett> keep wyckoff principles Pure and simple
<sal> the jist of it was you have to know how the commercials work for each market
<gary fullett> though it ids hard to master it will be benefical
<sal> or it does one no good
<gary fullett> I hope all of you understood the chart amos was talking about
<gary fullett> th same phases happen in distribution as well
<Jimbo> think I'll work at better identification of Wyckoff principles first.
<gary fullett> though they are reversed
<gary fullett> yep
<fibo> thanks gary nite
<gary fullett> fibo thank u
<gary fullett> night
<lmarsh> nite , see you guys tomorrow,....
<Peggy> nite, Fibo. Thank you for the email
User [fibo] left forum at Mon Apr 03 21:59:03 EDT 2000
<gary fullett> well lets call it a night now